Interview with Eugenia Lodine
By Bijoy M. Trentin and Emanuela De Luca
The training of future teachers is very topical, since it should be approved soon a decree that will redraw the route that will allow the university teaching qualification in schools of all levels. In that decree, unfortunately, still is not accompanied by a law (effective) on recruitment: it will be necessary, however, identify as soon as possible ways forward in order to contemplate the 'needs' both enabled with the new system expected to be temporary so-called historical, method and criteria apply throughout the national territory, while respect the special characteristics and local needs. In the debate, reference was made largely to the role and the 'space' of the internship: so we asked some questions about this topic to Eugenia Lodine (http://www.unibo.it/docenti/eugenia.lodini), Professor of Pedagogy experiment at the University of Bologna. [BMT]
The internship is ritenuto fondamentale nel processo di formazione dei futuri insegnanti: quali sono le sue peculiarità pedagogico-didattiche?
Sono fortemente convinta dell’importanza del tirocinio; tra l’altro nella formazione iniziale degli insegnanti – almeno dei maestri – è sempre stato presente il riferimento al tirocinio, anche se prima che diventasse un’esperienza universitaria esso era una sorta di “cenerentola”. Dal momento in cui la formazione è passata all’università, è aumentato il senso e il valore del tirocinio. Nei modelli di formazione iniziale, sia per la scuola dell’infanzia e primaria, sia per la scuola secondaria, il tirocinio è sempre stato l’anello bridge between the university and school, and this is his role, because it is a form of learning from experience different from the typical learning that takes place in laboratories and in university courses. Focus on learning experience is important, equally as important is that the educational institution to reflect on what is learned through the internship, what through the courses and what activities through workshops wings. Are there any studies on this, just to see what content, skills and abilities that can carry well with the internship. Then there are essentially two models that contrast: the model of training or experience as a place where you go to apply the theoretical knowledge you have learned, that "all I had to learn I learned at university and now I go to school and apply it in practice", the 'Another is a model here in Bologna we called "integration problems" between theoretical training and practice: I go to school, "collect" a series of traditional knowledge and skills that is crucial to learn from experience and then carry in my training and, together, I gained knowledge in my training and see how they are implemented in practice. This type of model is not è di applicazione di quello che ho appreso ma di interazione di quello che viene appreso nella situazione della scuola e di quello che viene appreso all’università. Il tirocinio può essere, inoltre, diretto e indiretto: il tirocinio diretto è svolto nella scuola ed assegna un ruolo molto importante alla riflessione sull’esperienza e alla documentazione; il tirocinio indiretto, invece, si svolge all’interno dell’università, ma ritengo che parlare della scuola nell’università sia utile prima dell’esperienza, come momento preparatorio, e dopo, come momento di riflessione, ma resta imprescindibile il fatto che lo studente debba fare esperienza all’interno della scuola.
Infatti il training has another important function of pedagogical-didactic: guidance to the student, who, when he goes to do the training, understand how it actually shakes the profession and then you realize it is a profession that in its practical realization corresponds to his expectations, his desires, and if you prefer to move towards the primary school or child. Now the new proposals suggest a degree program with a unified outlet, that will form a teacher who can teach in both the kindergarten and in elementary school, then a fortiori it will be important that the training takes place in both orders school so that students can understand what is lo scenario per cui si sta preparando.
Quali sono le caratteristiche del tirocinio attivato presso l’Università di Bologna?
Caratteristica importante dell’esperienza di tirocinio è [A] che si svolge sempre durante la formazione, questo è molto importante; esistono anche altri modelli di tirocinio e c’è stata anche un’epoca in cui si pensava che la formazione dell’insegnante avvenisse con quell’anno successivo alla conclusione dei corsi (come succede per il corso di laurea in Psicologia: prima ti laurei e poi fai l’esperienza di tirocinio); invece qui il modello su cui noi pedagogisti abbiamo insistito è quello del tirocinio durante proprio for what we said before, that is, the ability to modulate the targets in relation to the objectives of the training courses and workshops, and also to allow the 'interaction between the culture of the school and the university culture, [B] going gradually from a simple observation phase of activity involvement, [C] key element of the placement is the presence of the supervisor, and this was one of the innovations, both in SSIS that the degree course in Primary Education, that of provide for the separation of university teachers and school leaders, working in particular to manage this experience. Overall, in I think it was a very positive despite considerable difficulties, because the teacher who is seconded to the university is accustomed to working with children, and found working with young adults, should avoid having an attitude of mothering and try to develop a critical attitude. At the same time, it is also a very important element because it is a familiar figure from the school experience. I would say this was one of the extremely positive aspects of the degree course in Primary Education as of SSIS. [D] Another important aspect from our point of view has always been important, but learning from experience also reflect on their learning experience. So the training is not just a full immersion in practice, but is an activity that is critical reflection on experience, that can be done in various ways, for example, we have insisted on specific instruments (the logbook , documentation of experience, the report on the same) just as a means to reflect and to document what has been done. Since then the documentation is one of the flaws of the teachers who do not document what they are doing enough, we also try to put as an objective proxy for future teachers to get used to it an element of their professionalism. In addition, we produced Bologna written materials on the experience of training, supervisors have written books about their experiences on the website of this faculty is the listing of all training procedures, tools that are used [http:// www.scform.unibo.it/Scienze+ of + Education / Teaching / Internships / sfp_tirocinio.htm].
structural conformations What was the organization of training in time for the initial training of teachers in kindergarten and primary school?
In SSIS - to my knowledge - has been accentuated by the active role of training the student who goes and makes a lesson or part of a small segment, whereas in Primary Education have given too much importance to the phase of observation: being distributed in four-year course is an apprenticeship that begins with a phase only observational and arrives only at the end of four years to a stage where the teacher takes an active role in training.
Always with the same teacher?
Absolutely not, indeed, as the two-year period is the same for everyone, then a second two years in nursery school chooses to do is choose which primary school, basically in the first two years, the job must be done in both two orders school, then after the order has been chosen.
The organization of the current period should be retained or should it be changed? How?
you can always improve, but I think the key points that should be retained (including the draft on the other hand Israel is going in this direction) during training course, training in different types of school course, training with supervisors key element ; I would say that these aspects are safeguarded, because I personally believe that this training is vital in training, but training without reflection, without a practical theory is useless because it is blind, is not transmissible, does not make sense, the job must be an opportunity to do those experiences that are topical, that can be achieved only within the practice. For example, if I do not send a student to attend a college teacher, he will never understand what it is reading the rules or fail to understand what they mean peer relations, decision making, I explain it, but it is not the same thing. It is a situated knowledge, to be learned in this way. So do not emphasize, but my philosophy is: we choose what is important that you face in training compared to what is important that you make in the laboratory with respect to what is important that we do in a course, respect, finally, what is important that you face in the activity of the individual student. About
laboratories, in what they differ from the internship?
The laboratories are located in various degree courses, (it also includes the 270, also in SSIS) and are a form of educational type is characterized by a limited number of students, around thirty, and have the function of passage from theory to practice, that is to say, are situations where students are put to the test analysis, production of special educational or cultural forms, for example, there are laboratories of subject area, then in this case of mathematics education rather than teaching linguistics, then there are the laboratories of psycho-socio-pedagogical, for example the methodology of group work, or the production of evidence or the evaluation literature for 'childhood. But they are of lecture courses are courses in which a conductor with his group from the analysis of some issues is to direct experience to students. The core of the speech is: the laboratory is a course in small? If the answer is so wrong. The laboratory is a different kind of mediator teaching, so it's something that requires the student to get in the first person to experiment in activities that can also be used in his experience as a teacher and, before coming to his experience as a teacher, in his experience as a trainee. It is a sort of bridge from the course, which is theoretical, to the laboratory in which theory is combined with teaching experience to reconstruct the paths, training, in which this can be put into practice.
The new draft regulation for the initial training of secondary teachers expected (unless the next amendment) access, attendance and one-year internship Active. Reading the draft gets the impression that little has changed over the functioning of the old SSIS, that is that there is only a scaling time (probably due to the tendency to "rationalize"): what do you think? How do you think should be organized the initial training of secondary school teachers?
TFA: a plot is a bit 'more delicate, because the impression of a simple reduction in time, I had it too, on the other hand was increased by one year prior training, then the 3 +2 five years are now, whereas before there were four. But the problem seems to me another, in the proposal that came out you have an impression of inconsistency, there is, yes, an accentuation of speech training, but the science courses and education materials related to the approval of those are very separate, while in the construction of the training project should merge. Even before the SSIS, the training activities were more related exclusively to the discipline: the science courses of education were made in the first year and remained detached. This is something that I think is not good. From this point of view should be set up laboratories from which spring training projects so that skills are based science education and those of the individual disciplines. Example: An account is if I do docimology lesson and assessment un conto è se poi devo andare a ragionare su “come fai la valutazione di questo progetto?”, la valutazione di questo progetto ha a che fare con i tipi di obiettivo, di attività per cui devi mettere in sinergia questo elemento. Poi c’è un altro fattore che è di tipo istituzionale ma che avrà la sua importanza: dove saranno situati questi TFA? Presso una Facoltà come la nostra di Scienze della Formazione o presso le singole facoltà? La SSIS aveva avuto il grande pregio culturale di dire “la formazione degli insegnanti è trasversale rispetto alle facoltà”.
Però ora si stanno ideando lauree magistrali all’interno delle singole facoltà…
The masterful
yes, but they are provided for specific magisterial teachings of Education not yet. However, there is a reduction of space for science education, taking into account both the master that the TFA. We must make an effort to identify new models for this internship active, however, could begin operating this year and has not been activated and will not be activated even in my next year because the savings are realized not only in schools with the cuts in staff, but also with the "block the production" of new teachers.
There is the possibility of teaching the teachers, especially so those in the specification, which of course does not come from courses teaching-learning?
the training of university teachers, those who make university education is a fairly new topic in Italy, in Bologna, however, already there have been some research in this direction, for example by the Interdisciplinary Centre of Educational Research, which is one of the key points, which is also the institution from which the discourse of teacher education and SSIS. Surely there is a problem from this point of view, but as a culture has formed around the laboratories, for example, (shortly to be released on a text that laboratories our supervisors in training courses enabling special, however, initial teacher training), as a place-space to create a different culture, a culture of knowledge and know-how. On the other hand, even in the past there was the idea of \u200b\u200bthe workshop (I think the CEMEA for example, the Movement for Educational Cooperation) aims to create educational experiences. If we expect in the TFA greater integration between the educational sciences and disciplines in the design of certain types, certain activities, I think it benefits everyone: the disciplines of science education need to be able to see how they apply its principles in the field, but the application demands of general principles. Much will depend on the organization, in addition to places to make testing of different forms: Teaching, also because there are disciplines that are more advanced in the teaching discipline, others further back.
May 2010
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